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Rogaine Users - Regrowth and Shedding Cycles?

Discussion in 'Treatments for Androgenetic Alopecia' started by divinemiss, Jun 6, 2015.

  1. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    That’s a huge amount of hair yo lose, but I am right there with you. I count too. Is has been between 100-400 hairs for years now. Never a normal amount. You’re definitely going through hormonal telogen effluvium by the sounds. My shedding at its worst before minoxidil was probably 30 hairs on a bad day (I never used to shed more than a couple of hairs all my life before then). What happened with me is more that my hair just stopped growing and died. The shedding I experience is caused by minoxidil, which I am now stuck on.

    It seems as though chopping and changing hormones is what caused your shedding. For now, it may be wise not to change anything to see if it settles. TE can last for up to 6 months so maybe it will run its course.

    I will say, don’t hold too much faith in Spironolactone particularly at such a low dose. Also, if you find the shedding is persistent you may want to consider rogaine. This is how I see it: Try to hold off as much of the hairloss now as you can, just incase something potentially really life changing comes out in the future. For anyone with Androgenetic Alopecia, that is literally the only option we have. Save what you can now.
     
  2. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    So do you think I should continue taking 25mg Spironolactone for now so as to not change anything?
    Like do you think going off it might cause more shedding??
     
  3. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    It’s unlikely that discontinuing will cause too much fallout because you are on such a low dose
     
  4. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    Oh man. This is the patheticness of my current hair...and this is after spending 15 minutes styling it with millions of bobby pins and hairspray to make the top stand up like there’s some actual volume
     

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  5. Simona1986

    Simona1986 Established Member

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    Your hair looks great !!! I have a problem with styling my hair. The roots are so weak and all the styling cause more hair loss. Anybody in this situation?
     
  6. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    Literally anything I do with my hair causes loss.
     
  7. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    Yes Georgina, your hair looks amazing!! I am losing 200 to 300 hairs a day now for some reason, I could not imagine putting any hairspray, bobby pins or any other products in my hair! I wish...
    I seriously think at this point I could keep running my hands through my hair for several hours and it would all come out. Who needs clippers!
     
  8. electra

    electra Established Member

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    Regarding cortisol, stress, HPA:

    Yes, I've read that it can be the opposite, too--when the ovaries stop regulating/shut down, the adrenals take on the stress, and can't handle it, and cortisol levels can soar, hindering hair growth.

    HPA--Hypothalamus, Pituitary, Adrenals--the axis of stress-control, hormone control, etc. Stress can occur when the three parts are not 'conversing' well.

    Georgina, have you done anything to specifically control stress/cortisol? I'm sure you have...just can't remember. I've been taking adrenal support tablets, but who the hell knows if they're doing anything. Ugh.
     
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  9. electra

    electra Established Member

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    And--omg--yes, your hair looks amazing!!

    I just took a shower, and got a handful of hair. :( And, when I look at my front line, it's taken a step back. Again. Ugh. Ugh.
     
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  10. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    Isn’t that just the pits! We try all these things never knowing if we are helping our situation or hurting it...
    Most frustrating part!
    A year ago, heck, less than a year ago, prior to April, I NEVER gave a second thought to hair, vitamins, hormones, what to eat, what not to eat... Other than common sense.. I tried to eat clean most of the time..
    But I certainly never feared anything or could imagine losing my hair!!
     
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  11. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    Yeah I have tried various supplements like ashwaganda and curcumin.. many others. Nothing has helped with the hair.
    I have considered taking a small amount of a drug called Clonidine but with pharmaceuticals always comes greater risk. What are you using?
     
  12. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    How much Evening Primrose Oil are you taking? I started taking it 3 weeks ago... 500mg. Not sure if that’s standard or not?
    Also taking Omega 3 Complex:
    190mg of Docosahexaenoic Acid (DHA-from Alaskan Pollock)
    250mg of Eicosapentaenoic Acid (EPA- from Alaskan Pollock)
    Again... Not even sure if these are standard doses for Omega 3.

    I’m now losing 200 to 300 hairs a day for the last 2 weeks.
    Started a week after I started tons of vitamins a nutritional therapist put me on.
    I quit all the vitamins except Omega 3, Evening Primrose Oil and vitamin D. Can only hope that’s what triggered this shed and it stops right quick!
    My ends are looking super bad.. Like that’s where it’s most noticeable. The ends are like disintegrating into strings!! It looks so awful!
    And there is no way to disguise it anymore.
    People who saw me 2 weeks ago said they can definitely tell a difference from 2 weeks ago to now.
    Can’t put it up, can’t use products...
    Would just make even more hair fall out.
    The temples are bad too but they’ve always been thin even when I had gobs of hair! So I’m kind of used to that... And it never really bothered me. I’ve seen A LOT of girls with thin temples.
    But I literally have like no hair left at the bottom... It’s so weird because I usually see women with more pronounced thinning on top of head, yet they have decent density at the bottom so they can use hair fibers or even tattoo type camouflage... I’d be thrilled if I could do that! But mine is too diffuse..
    I will more than likely need be in a full wig by end of month...
    Last December I had so much hair it was thinned out. Literally strips of hair cut out and it was still thick!
    This December I need a wig!!
    Blows my mind and breaks my heart.
     
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  13. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    Evening primrose oil is a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor (like finasteride) and it works to increase blood circulation and vascularity. It contains omega 6 fatty acids which promote something called vascular endothelial growth factor. This is very good for hair, and if infact one of the main ways minoxidil works. There have been studies using omega 6 fatty acids for hair growth which show its efficacy. In fact, there is a minoxidil alternative topical which is currently being sold called Trinov, and one of the main ingredients is an omega 6 fatty acid.
    You want blood to reach your hair and lots of it. 500mg is not a huge dose so it shouldn’t be making a huge impact. I take 3 grams of the stuff and I don’t believe it has caused any extra shedding, although I am getting some of the side effects I got with dutasteride (like finasteride but much stronger), which include increased vaginal discharge (I know, sorry that’s gross).
    There’s otherwise no harm in taking a sensible amount of vitamin D and omega 3’s.
    I don’t think that’s causing your shedding.
    I am assuming you had everything checked and so know whether or not you are nutrient deficient. In any event, it also can’t hurt to take an iron, vitamin C, zinc and megnesium supplement.

    I can fully appreciate what it’s like to feel trapped and powerless. I’ve been feeling that way since I was 21. It takes your life from you. I wish I could find a way to solve everything, I truly wish that more than anything. I used to have beautiful hair... I will attach a photo.
    All we can do is keep trying and remember that we are not our hair.
     

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    #53 Georgina, Dec 8, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2018
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  14. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    I feel your pain girl! My head has been hemorrhaging hair for the last 2 weeks!
    My hair is quickly disappearing!
    2 people have told me it looks totally different since they saw me last 2 weeks ago..
    Makes me so sad!

    How much do you think you lose per day?
     
  15. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    Beautiful picture!! I am so sorry you’ve had to deal with this at such a young age.

    I am working super hard at letting go of what used to be. For me there has been no adjustment period. Feels like it happened overnight so I’m often in shock. One minute I was getting my hair thinned out, 2 months later something was off, 2 months later nothing had changed, 3 months later, bam! Losing hair like I never imagined...
    I’m trying now to learn to accept it, but it’s so hard.
    It’s so surreal..

    After taking the various vitamins the nutritional therapist put me on and I started shedding a week into it, I went and got my vitamins tested.
    My Selenium was high, like out of range high. I’ve read that too much Selenium, zinc, and vitamin A can all cause hair loss.
    My zinc was perfect. Not too high or too low but she had me on a high dose, and she had me on a lot of Selenium. So I pretty much ditched all the vitamins she gave me except Onega 3, EPO and vitamin D.
    My magnesium level was good too, but I do take magnesium from time to time. And I take vitamin C and prescription strength Viviscal... Oh and Vitron C. My ferritin was 11 end of July and is now 47.

    I’m weaning off of the spironolactone too because I don’t think that’s the answer for me.
    Praying so hard that going off the small dose I was on won’t cause a shed!!
    Oh dear God I cannot shed anymore!!
     
  16. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    I have lost anywhere from 100-400 hairs on any given day since July 2015. Never less than that. Every day. This is now what the top of my head looks like. Probably only have about 30% of my hair left. Just for reference I’ll add a photo from 2 years ago so you can see the rate of loss.
     

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  17. electra

    electra Established Member

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    Georgina, I think Jtilly and I are happy to hear what you have to say--you're an eloquent writer and sound so knowledgeable. Thank you! I will start the Evening Primrose again, for sure!!

    You look beautiful--I hope it's some consolation that you will be gorgeous despite your hair. But I know it's devastating, of course.

    JTilly, I really have no idea how much i lose! Sometimes a big strand comes out that I know is made up of many strands...And throughout the day, i have no idea what comes out without my knowing! Maybe it's not as much as I think? Although all day I absentmindedly pull hair easily out of my head. So freaking gross, I know.
     
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  18. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    Yes Georgina, I definitely appreciate all your feedback and knowledge!!
    And yes, you are very beautiful, hair or no hair!! ❤️

    Electra,
    I wish I didn’t count.. I wish I wasn’t so good at collecting almost every last one. Tho I’m most positive, quite a few probably slip past me.
    My family and friends can not figure out for the life of them how I manage to capture almost each one!
    Guess my OCD and being so methodical/meticulous is really paying off... gah!
    I tried one day not to count. Thinking it would spare me from unnecessary anxiety. (This was back when the sheds weren’t too terrible yet. I was just counting to keep any eye on it).
    However, not counting that day actually gave me more anxiety. Because I didn’t have the reassurance of knowing.
    Because at the time, often it looked worse than it was.
    Now... Now it’s actually worse than it looks...
    Yuck...
    Today I lost 113 in shower alone. (Counting hairs I gently combed out before shower, hair that came out in shower, ~even have a hair catcher, and gently combed with a wide tooth comb after shower, lost a whopping 76 hairs!! Gulp!! I could have puked!

    Its crazy because I shed a lot before. Since I was little kid, I shed a fair amount because I had so dang much hair! My mother used to get mad at me if I left my hairs pasted to the shower wall. Haha!
    It never occurred to me once in my life to count my hairs.
    I actually loved the shed. It felt good..

    Georgina or Electra,
    What dose is good for Evening Primrose Oil? Currently I’m on 500mg...
     
  19. Georgina

    Georgina Established Member

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    Well, there have been studies in men which showed improved hair growth with up to 6g of EPO:

    “In a test of the effectiveness of the invention, four middle-aged males with rapidly progressing baldness were treated orally with either 6g of evening primrose oil or 6g of a mixture of evening primrose oil and concentrated fish oil (20%) per day. The primrose oil provided approximately 90mg of 18:3n-6 (gamma-linolenic acid, GLA) per gram and the fish oil 180mg of 20:5n-3 (eicosapentaenoic acid, EPA) and 120mg of docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) per gram. After delays of 4 to 8 weeks, all four individuals reported unequivocal hair growth, with extension of hair growth to previously bald areas of the scalp, and a strengthening of growth in those areas where hair was present but thinning. Topical application of the unsaturated fatty acids provides better results by increasing the concentration of the fatty acid at the hair follicle level.

    In further tests, one male applied pure evening primrose oil twice per day to half the beard area. After about two weeks, the rate of beard growth on the side of the face to which the oil had been applied was definitely less than on the other side. Similarly, one female shaved both legs and then applied evening primrose oil twice daily to one leg only. After a period of 6-8 weeks it could be seen that the rate of hair growth was substantially less on the leg to which the oil had been applied.

    These preliminary tests indicate that both oral and topical application of unsaturated fatty acids is able to modulate the actions of androgens on the hair follicles, stimulating hair growth on the scalp and reducing it on other areas of the body.”

    That being said, it may be too high of a dose for women, and we don’t reallY know what effects that doses this high will have on women given the lack of clinical studies in this area. I would say tentatively that a good dose is somewhere between 500mg and 2g.
     
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  20. Jtilly

    Jtilly Established Member

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    Those photos look very similar to mine, except mine went from your photo on the bottom to the one on top in 5 months.
    It’s been horrifying. I don’t know how it’s happening so bloody fast.
    Everyone says “Don’t stress” and trust me, I get it... Stress = bad news for hair loss, but dang!
    I can’t even take a breather for one day because my head is shaving itself everyday!
    I can’t even have the time to process what is happening or come up with a game plan.
    I guess we don’t get to choose how our hair loss unfolds... and it’s never pleasant no matter how it happens.
    I’ve definitely kept my stress levels super low, in particular between the months of September to Thanksgiving... Was staying super positive, distracting myself, etc, etc... Then the bottom dropped out and all he## broke loose 2 weeks ago.
    Dang I hate how this has changed me. I’ve tried and continue to try so hard to have hope, to stay positive, to just accept what’s happening.
    Sadly I think I’m failing miserably the last week...

    Thank you so much for all your responses!! No one else understands this. My family and friends all mean well, but they just don’t get it. My very best friend, who I love so much like a sister, actually said to me she’s jealous of my hair because she hates fussing with hers so much... (Insert face plant)
    I told her if she’s so sick of messing with her hair, then she could always just shave it and viola! Problem solved! Haha!
    Sigh...
     

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